Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nasher

Nasher was proposed for deletion. This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was to delete the article.

Possibly fake entry. Same IP made entry in german WP (see de:Nasher), where users concluded, that info is wrong. Fake Source: No entry to Nasher in Encyclopædia Britannica. --212.162.50.69 09:22, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Keep. If it is fake, then so would be Ghaznavid Empire where Nasher is referenced. Somebody probably needs to research this one in greater detail to check the facts. -- RJH 21:55, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

FWIW, the empire article didn't mention nasher from its creation in april until a couple 62. ip edits in late sept--from what I found, most of the rest seems to check out, although further review certainly wouldn't hurt. Niteowlneils 23:40, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

It looked like one of those clever bits where they took the legitimate text of a real article and only inserted nonsense 2-3 critical places, then followed with similar pops elsewhere. However, I don't read German; the .de Wikipedia discussion would be helpful here, and anyone who is conversant with German could help out by seeing what they had to say and providing a summary. Geogre 02:24, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Delete. Prank/fiction. No encyclopedia I checked has an entry for anything Nasher or Nashir. I spent over an hour down at the library trying to verify this article and found nothing but contradictions and absurdities. one branch went to central Asia where Osman of Ghazni (1259-1326) founded the Ottoman Empire... a) the Ottoman Empire was founded in Turkey which hardly seems like "central asia", b) it was founded by a guy named Osman, but none of the encyclopedias I looked at mentioned any connection to Ghazni/Ghaznavid. Afghanistan's largest port is called Shir Khan... a) Afghanistan is a land-locked country b) Of the four Afghan maps I looked at only one considered Shir Khan big enuf to even be on the map, and it's not one of the ~2 dozen provincial capitals. As for the "Literature" section, I checked the six volume "Biography & Geneology Master Index", "Twentieth Century Authors", and the four volume "World Authors 1900-1950", and neither George Bonnet, nor Edward Merton were listed in any of them. According to the encyclopedias, Genghis Khan ended the Ghurid rule in 1219, replacing it with puppet rulers called the Kert or Kurt, described as a 'Tajaki line' (if I remember correctly, it added that they were relatives of the Ghurids (as in, not the Ghaznavids as Nasher suggests). Niteowlneils 02:21, 15 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Delete: Award yourself a Barnstar with Oak Leaf for that, Niteowlneils. Thanks for the hard work. This is, I suppose, what happens when we have to prove that an article is nonsense before we say "delete" rather than asking that the article prove its validity. Geogre 04:13, 15 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Keep The article is mostly correct. The connection between the Ghaznavids and the Ghorids is not very clear indeed. Despite of a few keen historical assumptions the article is correct. Very good job, Niteowlneils. You do deserve a lot of respect for your work!

However, when looking for verification, don't forget to check under the term "Ghaznavids" (that's where it is referred to in the Encyclopaedia Britannica as well). The fact that Osman was a Ghaznavid is undisputed among historians. Please double check on that. Whether you consider Turkey to be in Central Asia or not is a minor problem. Stephen (from Special:Contributions/217.247.75.35)

Verify before taking further action. Alphax (talk) 04:30, Nov 17, 2004 (UTC)
I find it very interesting that none of the cited works appear on either Google or Worldcat. Based on that, and Niteowlneil's comment above, delete as a hoax. —No-One Jones ^(m) 08:47, 17 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Delete. I'm very suspicious when only one person appears to have heard of some subject. All the info cited below appears to have been added by the same person. This hoax is going to take a LOT of cleanup. The "What links here" for Nasher will get you some of it, but I don't think that's all. Isomorphic 16:26, 17 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Most of the info in the article is indisputably correct: -All the information on the Ghaznavid dynasty is correct. -The Nasher did found Kunduz and they did come from Ghazni. -Zahir Shah's uncle Shah Mahmood Khan did murder Shir Khan Afghan Nasher. -Rudyard Kipling does have the Name Shir Khan from Afghanistan (see his Biographie). -Today, Gholam Rabani Nasher is in the Loya Jirga, Farhad Darya is a Nasher.

Whether or not the Nashir are descendants of the Ghaznavids is a fact taken for granted by the Afghan people. All we can verify today though is that the Nashir were Khans in Ghazni for a couple of centuries. What legitimized their status was their link to the Ghaznavids. However, as Afghan history is not interesting to many, the subject has been neglected and not much is available. Original prints and handwritings were all in the Nasher Library in Kunduz which was burned down during the communist invasion. I was there as a young man, visiting from England. Peter Levy was there, too. He wrote a book about what we saw there, it is called "In the Light Garden of the Angel King". Please keep.

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like other '/delete' pages is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion or on the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page