Talk:Demographics of Mexico

A small section on genetics like in the Spanish version?

Given the controversy and ambiguity surrounding census groups, do you think it would make sense to add a genetics section like in the Spanish article? [1]. Humanophage (talk) 13:06, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Photos used are highly misleading

The placement of photographs of celebrities who are disproportionately light-skinned and Euro-looking is grossly misleading in demonstrating the actual demographics of Mexico, something which is obvious to anyone who is from there or has visited. Celebrities are mostly from the privileged/connected class of Mexican society and so reflect the special demographics of that class rather than the demographics of the country as a whole. Photographs of any market or street scene in a non-elite part of any city or the countryside would be far more accurate and appropriate. Tmangray (talk) 00:27, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

Do we really need a long treatise on how many Mexicans have the mongolian spot?

A lot of work required in this article. But I have fixed the major race-related fixations including a strange categorization which includes Germans as whites and excludes Jews which makes me wonder who wrote this section.Huasteca (talk) 23:33, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

It's a small paragraph within a section dedicated to phenotypical traits, it's size is appropiate as it currently is. In regards to the paragraph mentioning German Mexicans, that one is being added by you and only you[2]. If you mean the German Mexicans paragraph in the article of Mexicans, that one was added by a now-blocked editor named Php2000, who has various edits that pair with edits made by you, such as creating separate ethnic "identities" within said article[3], which is something you are currently trying to do in this one[4]. Pob3qu3 (talk) 01:01, 19 April 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:

• Horizonte-GDL.jpg

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 20:37, 25 April 2022 (UTC)

Removal of a part

Pob3qu3, do not remove the graph I added, I added it to try to give readers a better understanding of how the Mexican demographic is like. PedroDonasco (talk) 05:14, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

Let’s discuss here about the graph rather than engaging in an edit war. I believe it should be kept in, like I said, it gives readers a better understanding, not only that but the same figures used in that graph are also used in their respective pages but aren’t removed, so I don’t see why the graph should be removed. PedroDonasco (talk) 05:26, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

First of all, for the indigenous figure. > https://www.gob.mx/cms/uploads/attachment/file/766887/Infografia_adolescente_y_adolescente_indigena_2022_FIN_1.pdf < This is a document from the mexican government in which full indigenous adolescents are defined by either indigenous household or indigenous language spoken, not by simply self identification. > https://www.gob.mx/cms/uploads/attachment/file/696544/15_MEX.pdf < > https://www.gob.mx/cms/uploads/attachment/file/696534/05_COAH.pdf < > https://www.gob.mx/cms/uploads/attachment/file/696546/17_MOR.pdf < > https://www.gob.mx/cms/uploads/attachment/file/696551/22_QRO.pdf < Other government documents that define full indigenous peoples as those who have an indigenous ethnicity or speak an indigenous language, making the population 11,800,247. > https://www.ecosur.mx/uno-de-cada-tres-indigenas-tiene-como-idioma-materno-al-espanol/ < > https://www.scjn.gob.mx/derechos-humanos/sites/default/files/pagina-basica/archivos-genericos/caso-hipotetico-camino-corte-2022.pdf < Here are some others that highlight the indigenous population. And for the White Mexican figure, 50% of Mexicans are not white, the government data is counting lighter skinned Mexicans, a mexican can be of predominantly native DNA yet have light skin. Different studies state the white mexican population to be around 2 times less, from 20%-30% of the population instead, most Mexicans are mestizo and have a mixture of spanish and native DNA, it wouldn’t make sense to remove the table as it adds on to what I had just said, and what was said before. PedroDonasco (talk) 05:42, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

I am aware that, when it comes to Indigenous Peoples Mexico's government has used different criterias to define them, the article in fact already mentions this, thus I don't see why you insist on removing some sources to imposse another, or whats the point on copy-pasting a table just changing a pair of percentages, by doing this you aren't "helping to improve the understanding of Mexican demographics" what you are doing is confusing readers. same thing goes for the case of White Mexicans: I don't see why your argument would have to be impossed over data obtained on field surveys conducted by the government merely because you say so, especially considering how much the results of genetic studies conducted in Mexicans tend to vary or the fact that most of them have used less than 100 volunteers, with no mention that genetic studies tend to interpret ambiguous data (haplotypes present independently in both, Europeans and Amerindians for example) or noisy data[5][6], because of all the aforementioned issues Mexican geneticists themselves state that genetic studies shouln't be used to attemp to delineate race or ethnicity[7]. Pob3qu3 (talk) 02:34, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

That is because like it is stated within the article itself, mestizos are severely undercounted in the chart, only having 30%. It’s known white Mexicans don’t make up half of the Mexican population, that would be an overstatement given the large mestizo population of Mexico. Mexico is recognized by the government and by the general public to be a mostly mestizo country, with at least 60% of the mexican population being a mestizo, I was trying to make a graph similar to what the censuses of other countries do by identifying specific race rather than using overestimations. PedroDonasco (talk) 03:26, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

This "trying to unearth the real demographics of a country to see how many people are actually mixed" thing is something that could be done in many other countries (I've seen something similar attempted on Argentina), but its a rocky terrain and I don't think is up to you to decide if it gets done or not (or if you try to do it and meet with opposition from other editors, at least respect said opposition). Also consider that if we went by your standards and attempted "to unearth the real demographics of Mexico" by doing the roughest analyzis of evidence possible you would end up finding that the estimates you currently want to introduce to the article are wrong: Phenotypical data (hair color, eye color, skin color, blood types etc.) aswell as historic census records point to the number of Whites and Mestizos in Mexico being even, furthermore consider that if to the current 30% estimation of Mestizos you complain about you add the 12% that comes from people who declared to have partial indigenous ancestry in the Indigenous Peoples estimate from the INEGI you get close to even numbers, meaning the current estimates are not that off from the result you would get if you got things to go your way. Pob3qu3 (talk) 04:11, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Alright then, so we can form a consensus not to add the graph to the page. I see your points now. I recommend you check out my Spanish talk page, I have messaged there. PedroDonasco (talk) 04:36, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

If you could, check our my English talk page to resolve the dispute, thanks. PedroDonasco (talk) 10:02, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Consensus agreed upon, content will not be added. PedroDonasco (talk) 06:01, 17 January 2024 (UTC)